If you’re like me, you’ve seen your fair share of couples talking on TV or whatever about how happily married they are.
Maybe they’ve been blissfully married 50 years, etc., etc.
Have you ever noticed how often they talk about how LITTLE they’ve argued over the years?
I mean, my own parents have rarely—if ever—argued with each other, at least in front of us, their offspring. And yes, they truly have been blissfully married for over 50 years.
I’ve really never met two people who agree on most everything the way they do.
For what it’s worth, the foundations of what I’ve learned about what a great relationship should look like were formed at a very young age. My parents have always been a shining example of that.
But hold on a second.
Despite the evidence I’ve seen at home and on TV, is how much or how little a couple argues really ALWAYS such an effective barometer of “relationship health” as we’ve blindly given it credit for being all these years?
This question has been rattling around in my head for at least a decade, perhaps spawned by the excellent blog “Things My Girlfriend And I Have Argued About” (and subsequent eponymous novel, which I highly recommend) by Mil Millington.
I mean, the basic premise there is that Millington and his main squeeze are actually HAPPIER together because they both love to challenge each other so much.
It’s as if they’d be miserable and likely break up were they to actually STOP arguing.
So hey…as “nice” as it is that some couples can peacefully coexist without even a hint of a disagreement for literally scores of years, I’ve got to think that personality type and how much they tend to enjoy a lively debate have to be taken into consideration.
But here’s something deeper—and perhaps more mind-blowing—to consider.
My parents (and others like them) notwithstanding, it’s altogether unreasonable to expect that a couple will agree on EVERYTHING absolutely ALL the time.
Assuming that simple truth, which I believe is a safe thing to do, then if life proceeds without argument with a measure of consistency that would make a Swiss watch jealous, then I’d offer something may actually be more WRONG than RIGHT.
Here’s what I’m talking about here.
I think I’d need a whole hand to count the number of times the following has happened.
Back when I was in the corporate world, I’ll have been sitting in the audience at some company-wide convention as a speaker is announced who has worked there for, say, 30 years.
The guy presenting the speaker (who is almost invariably his boss) will say something to the effect of, “I’ve never heard him complain once. What a great example he is for everyone to follow! Please welcome him to the podium.”
Similarly, I once attended a retirement party for a guy who’d been a “company man” for something like 40 years.
He too had “never complained”, working for some four decades without argument…about anything. Of course, bosses heaped high praise upon him for that.
Everyone marveled at his commitment to the company, then they gave him a watch or something. Then he stopped coming to work. And then they replaced him with someone much younger–who they probably had to pay more and give better bennies to.
Maybe it’s the “entrepreneurial spirit” in me, but you know what? If there’s a problem, I’m going to bring it up.
Sure, I’m going to accompany my grievance with a suggested solution. But yes…if there’s a complaint in need of being registered, I’m not going to be shy about it.
You see, I think that if you “don’t complain” you’ll get paid exactly the salary the company wants to pay you, and you’ll rise through the corporate ranks at exactly the rate your passive attitude propels someone else towards putting you first (which may be never).
Let’s just spell it out: The “non complainers” MAY be the same ones who stay at the company for so many years not necessarily because they’re so valued by their employers, but rather because they fail to ask hard questions along the way that may have led them on a different course.
That’s not to say, of course, that their employers are anything less than gratified by the whole scenario.
When I went to work for a Fortune 50 company at what I imagined at the time to be my dream job, I had the luxury of already having been gainfully employed throughout the recruitment process.
This meant that when I didn’t like their initial offer—or their second—I pushed back. Likewise, whenever something came up that raised a red flag about the prospect of working there, I asked the “hard questions”.
And sure enough, they hired my opinion-laden self anyway.
Guess what? Once I took the job and moved to San Antonio, I was one of the most outspoken critics of “Dilbert, Inc.” type leadership in my entire regional office of over 200 people.
My boss called me the “highest-maintenance employee he’d ever managed”. Let’s just say nobody ever, ever introduced me as the “guy who never complained”.
And yet, because of “corporate policy” it wasn’t until I left that I found out I had been the highest paid guy in my sizable workgroup by a factor of at least 20%…despite being the youngest and having the least seniority.
Some other, more “quiet” guys getting paid far less had been there for 30 years—all the while looking forward to their annual inflation-adjusted pay increase.
So what does all this have to do with male/female relationships?
It’s very simple, really. I believe there’s a parallel to be drawn between how things work in the business world and how they work in a long-term relationship.
I strongly suspect that, like employees who work “quietly” until retirement, there are lots and lots of passive partners in relationships who get steamrolled on a regular basis.
Why? Because in their mindset it beats “arguing”.
But show me someone who is mortally afraid of confrontation, and I’ll show you the man or woman of a manipulative control freak’s dreams.
Can you see how “never arguing” may not be a Pollyannaish vision of relational perfection, after all?
Now again—to be sure—let me underscore that I am NOT saying something weird like “all happy couples should argue more”.
Nevertheless, here’s the truth: Emily and I argue. We do so probably once a week, actually.
Yeppers…if something isn’t right, we freely voice a “complaint” to one another.
And sometimes there’s a “counterpoint” to be made in response.
I wouldn’t say we have a Millingtonian attraction to arguing, per se. We don’t particularly like it.
But what Emily and I DO like is being transparently honest with each other and having one another’s best interests at heart. And see, that isn’t always something that can go forward on “autopilot” without some redirection here and there.
Passionate people can and will make their case with a bit more enthusiasm than others, no doubt. So the very definition of “arguing” may itself be open to debate, if you will. By definition, stating one’s case in and of itself counts as an “argument”. Somewhere between there and the Hatfields vs. McCoys is plenty of middle ground.
But the reason I know Emily and I have a healthy relationship—despite being “arguers”—is that we really, truly DO have each other’s best interests at heart.
We don’t lose control over our emotions.
We’re both reasonable people (which is crucial) and therefore we always find a workable solution to whatever’s on the table.
And most of all, we don’t EVER insult or belittle each other. We adore each other even in the midst of disagreement.
Those factors, in our minds at least, differentiate “arguing” from all-out “fighting”. “Fighting” indicates a battle for superiority, and I can’t see how that would be healthy at all vis-a-vis the concept of “having each other’s best interests at heart”.
Emily and I may never be celebrated as “the couple who never, ever argued”, but we’re often referred to by our friends and acquaintances as “the happiest couple they know”.
That’s good enough for us. No argument there.
Be Good,
Scot McKay
P.S. So what’s your opinion on this? Make it known (even if it’s a complaint and/or a full on argument) by commenting below. And what’s your view on the value of “make up sex”…I didn’t even go there at all.
I know you touched on this a little but I think it would be wise to also have guidelines for arguing if you are going to advocate it. I think there are very few people who truly have the best interest of the other person in mind in an argument.
And you may want to point out what an argument is…. And what it is not….. I think it could be safer to have a discussion about something rather than an argument……
@CH I’m haven’t exactly “advocated” arguing, as I said in the blog. That would be weird. For example, I don’t think my parents would be even happier together if they started arguing.
The problem is that a lot of couples get hung up on the idea of NOT arguing, and think that’s the key to happiness. Not so.
As for guidelines, the ones in the last few quick paragraphs of the post pretty much spell it out. It’s straightforward stuff.
Scot,
I guess as was pointed out, You did use arguing in somewhat of a nebulous way and in a different tone than I think most people understand arguing.
Anytime I have seen or been involved in an argument… People are only interested in their own point of view and could care less what the other person thinks or feels….. When two people argue they are unwilling to listen or have anything to do with an idea that there is anyones point but their own…
On the other hand, I do agree with the over all point that if something needs to be talked about (not argued about) then by all means talk about it….
Arguing carries a very negative connotation in my mind….
When you went to discuss a possible alternative to the way things where being done at work with your boss, I hardly think you went in with an argumentative attitude. Rather,I would think you went in with a very humble and intelligent approach to discuss alternative ways to do something you saw as a problem.
Scot,
I wouldn’t say arguing is the right word. …It’s more like a ‘joint leadership’ just trying to find a viable workaround to a challenge that both can be happy with.
…or a direction that two can live with, if you will.
Arguing tends to involve anger or one person trying to ‘be right’ …and there’s no place for that in a loving relationship.
Great point…. I was thinking the same thing when I read it….
Simply put I disagree Pete L. In my opinion arguing (by your definition) does happen-even in loving relationships and that doesn’t mean the couple doesn’t love each other. It means they’re human like everyone else and make mistakes. What matters is they learn and grow together towards making compromises and, like Scott says ‘keep each others best interests at heart’. I feel we could all use alot more realistic advice than pie-in-the sky utopian fantasies like “real love has no conflict”..
Once again Scott you hit the nail on the head about this. It’s refreshing to hear (or read rather) the ‘road less traveled’& straight shot approach rather than the same old tired stuff everyone else says. Works just fine for my rebel nature, lol.
“Argument” is indeed a somewhat nebulous term, but for the purpose hear it implies disagreement. Emotional people are going to disagree in an emotionally heightened way, but that doesn’t necessarily make them unfit for a relationship. So I won’t begrudge them that.
Hey Scott I am glad you addressed this because I have been wondering this for some time. Thanks for your insight! My next question is about pms. What is the best way to handle a woman when she is a temporary monster?
I’m the wrong guy to ask about PMS.
Let’s just say this. I dated a long string of women who have NEVER been afflicted by it up to and including Emily.
*All* of those women suspected that other women use PMS as an excuse for being bitchy when they feel like it.
To be clear, I’m not going to offer any clinical analysis of PMS because I’m not qualified. It may be very real for many women.
That said, two points:
1) There are women who aren’t PMSing for a certain part of every month out there, and it’s undeniable that those women are better to be in a relationship with.
2) I give ZERO slack when it comes to claiming they’re not responsible for their own actions. So PMSers and I aren’t going to get along well.
For what it’s worth…this is not a gender-specific thing. Guys with low testosterone levels who get cranky and weird should take responsibility for that and get things taken care of. The women in their lives will thank them for it.
Scott,
This style of communication and negotiation makes a lot of sense. After thinking about what you wrote, the biggest reason a lot of couples have long-term challenges in their relationships, is because they don’t deal with these small disagreements when they first come up.
If it’s left to fester and the husband or wife is mad about it (but never says that they are), until the frustration hits a boiling point for one (or both) – which could end up in a bigger argument, more hurt feelings and damage to the relationship.
I’ve never been married, but this is how I think this could play out in a marriage or LTR. Let me know if you think I’m on the right track – have a great weekend.
Yes, you make a BRILLIANT point.
Absolutely. This applies to ANY relationship, romantic or otherwise.
I’d love to have 30 year job security. At my age it would take me right up to 65. And without worrying about getting fired or laid off (which is currently almost nonexistent) I could create a life plan on that fiundation. Since most women don’t care where you work, only if you work, get that issue out of the way quickly. And assuming you work full time and don’t have kids, you most likely have your own car and place, so you got the other two questions women always ask out of the way. So then you can get on with more important stuff.
Hello there, I discovered your website by way of Google even as searching for a related subject, your site came up, it appears to be like great. I’ve bookmarked it in my google bookmarks.
Undoubtedly a wonderful written piece! Weve book marked it and mailed it out to pretty much all of my close friends simply because I know they are going to fascinated, thank you very much!
Hey Scott
I really like your anecdote about working in the Fortune 500 company and how you asked for what you wanted and ultimately got it. Very inspiring. I feel like I am a very passive person and am afraid to ask for what I want, which I think is my downfall. Basically I want to be able to communicate what I want but in a positive way.
I also agree with a previous comment that it would be useful if you could outline the best way to “argue” to avoid hurt feelings etc. Once again a great article!
Again, the best way to argue is disarmingly simple…as laid out in the final paragraphs.
Remember this always: At the workplace, no reasonable employer is going to besmirch an employee with a reasonable request. If they do, then it’s time to leave that job anyway.
You hit it out of the park with this, Scot.
The only thing I see fit to add has to do with earlier in a relationship, a lesson I learned the hard way.
When a woman flips out and argues about some little thing, it might not be disrespect, but a sign that she’s actually getting comfortable with the relationship, and able to open up.
The first time this happened I took it as disrespect and ingratitude, pulled away, and lost what was in retrospect a really good relationship.
So if your partner starts to argue, as long as it doesn’t involve personal attacks, it might not necessarily be such a bad thing, they might just be opening up.
Well stated, Scot,
Frank
I’d agree with that. If she was shy at first but then begins to air reasonable grievances, then that’s a sign of comfort…a good thing.
The only caveat is if she’s NAGGING. That’s a sign that the guy isn’t “manning up” and fulfilling on what she found attractive about his masculinity to begin with–and perhaps feels she’s beginning to take it on herself (e.g. decision making, proactivity, courage, ambition, etc.)
That makes sense, though it stands to reason nagging would be more a pattern than an unexpected, isolated explosion that comes out of left-field.
Nagging would definitely would indicate something’s amiss, which could be a combination of the man lacking leadership or the woman just being unreasonable and too demanding.
In the case above, I didn’t pace myself early in the relationship, and set the bar too high for the level of excitement to be sustainable. There was bound to be a letdown.
I don’t want to go into the gory details, as what’s done is done, and I want to attract better energy. But it’s better for people to learn from someone else’s lessons, and this is posted for their benefit.
I think this topic goes far deeper than romantic relationships, like you suggest by mentioning it in the context of work too. I think having the self esteem to stand up for yourself, especially in a high pressure environment is a massive life skill. Add in the ability to fight in an appropriate way, and not come across like a deranged monster, and you have a huge social skill there to boot.
That said, I think I’ve always felt more comfortable in relationships with some fire. To me it’s about the two of you being on a level and able to stand side by side rather than one of you being needy and submitting to the other’s will, whether that’s out of fear or whatever. And if the two of you are equals, mentally and emotionally, then hell, you’re going to disagree sometimes, so embrace it man, it’s called being alive 🙂 x
Arguing, as I define it, is a horrible thing for a relationship.
Discussion is lovely.
The thing is, we’re all capable of the former but few couples are have mastered the latter–particularly when it involves a discussion about themselves.
Every relationship has a set of contentious, hot button items that, if touched upon, are likely to ignite a real conflagration of hurt feelings and recriminations.
Most couples learn to stay away from these areas because experience has shown that the most delicate of treading is required; and the risk of traipsing there is not worth the reward.
It’s much easier to discuss other people, other things, than ourselves.
It’s doubtful she’s going to get offended if you call the mail lady a lazy, slovenly slob who takes half a day to deliver on our block because she’s lollygagging about, gossiping with every postal customer she happens to bump into.
Take me making that same basic observation but substitute my dear mother in law for the mail lady and bam, I’m likely going to wind up paying a visit to the local homeless shelter tonight.